As it says above. I believe the lack of STARs is a scenery problem due to removal of 21/03. But the ILS10L missing is definitely a Navigraph thing as I have had everything uninstalled except navigraph, and it worked without.
111.30 doesn’t show the 10L runway, only 28R
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Looking at KPDX in LittleNavMap with Navigraph cycle 2111 Rev 3 active, this approach shows as “LOC LDA RW08”. The actual approach is indeed a full ILS, and is labeled ILS 10L on r/w charts.
It appears to be correct in default MSFS nav data, showing as ILS10L with GS
I’m using the latest version of LNM - version 2.6.17z If I uninstall Navigraph (2111 Rev 3) from MSFS and re-scan the scenery database in LNM, the KPDX ILS10L shows as exactly that. If I re-install Navigraph and rebuild the LNM database again, it definitely shows as “LDA LOC 08”. This is what shows if I hover the mouse pointer over the center of the extended runway centerline. The displayed frequency is correct: 111.3, as is the identifier: IVGD. If I look in the text list of procedures as you posted above it DOES show as ILS10L.
The “LOC LDA RW08” appears when you hover the mouse on the map over the green extended ILS arrow pointing northwest from the runway 10L threshold. Also, on the map, the beam width of the localizer appears much wider than that of the adjacent runway 10R localizer. This is not the case when reverting to MSFS default nav data - both localizers have the same beam width.
Jim Barrett
Hi,
after nearly 10 hours of analyzes, I guess I have found the “problem”. It´s a very tricky one and I guess not very common:
KPDX 10L has 111.30 with the ident IVDG, also in our data - I have checked it:
… but now, short before 10L is KVUO (Vancover Person) and this airport has and LDA approach for runway 08, with exactly the same frequency 111.30 and the same ident IVDG because this LDA uses the same localizer antenna as KPDX 10L.
KVUO LDA approach 08, 111.30 (IVDG) - also in our data:
I have now compared the stock data records with our records, nearly identically expect the ILS name in the stock data for KVUO.
In the stock data for KVUO it´s defined as ILS RW10L with a glideslope
In our data for KVUO, it´s defined as LDA RW08 without a glideslope
So, first the ILS for KVUO in the stock data is wrong because it´s no ILS approach nor can you use a GS, nor is it for 10L into KVUO. It looks now, that ASOBO/MS has “copied” the KPDX ILS record for 10L into the KVUO ILS record, to avoid frequency issues like you have now with our data.
Sorry, but I have no clue, how the sim recognize the frequencies for an airport/runway and I have also no clue, how we can handle this. The data (our data) are correct so far, but will not be shown due the equal usage of the ILS on different airports. By the way, it looks LNM can´t also handle this - thats the reason why you see the LDA LOC 08 text.
Again, that´s status quo … I´m pretty sure, that this is an issue in the sim now …
Cheers,
Richard
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Very interesting! It appears that the airports are doing a “two for the price of one” system. I don’t think I’ve ever seen this sort of thing anywhere else. I can understand how the sim’s internal approach logic (or LNM’s) might get confused by this r/w arrangement.
Right, I also have never seen this before and when you had asked me before, I had negate that this is existing in RL. Ever day a new day … you never stop learning.
I also guess, thats the result of a kind of runway mixing between these two airports. It’s really very trick and thats not a normal situation so, for me absolutely ok that this was “overseen” during any tests.
Cheers
Richard
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