KHIO: SIDs are missing

Hi,

for the KHIO Portland-Hillsboro Airport the required SID “SCAPO7” is missing. Gernally it is included in the Navigraph-data, as I do have it in XPlane, but not in MSFS 2020

Regards,
Florian

I can add the following: If I uninstall the Navigraph data, so I am using the original MSFS2020-included data, the SIDs are there. With Navigraph they are missing

Hi Florian,
the reason is, that ASOBO makes an 1:1 reference to the runway-ident. In this case you have runway 2 instead of runway 02. It´s the same, yes - but it seems that the sim compare the runway idents and when they are not 100% equal, the procedures will be suppressed.

image

As in this case: All procedures for 02/20 are suppressed - therefore you see only the BERNI and CHRISM SID because both are only valid for 13R/31L. In no FMC you can enter 2 for runway 2, you must always enter 02, so it´s impossible for us to know, which runway has a leading zero and which not.

In my case, this is a bug in the sim because again, no FMC nor Garmin allow you to enter only one letter for a runway. Sorry Florian, but I would report this to ASOBO.

Cheers,
Richard

@NAVData I am not sure the missing leading zero is the problem, as there are other airports where the 0 is missing in the GUI and they still have procedures for that runway. Also that value is stored as a number in the data so a leading 0 would be just a display formatting.

I found another issue with the Procedures that I think may be the cause of the problem.
MSFS does not include Runway 13L/31R, only 13R/31L, but in the Navigraph files procedures for this runway is included, and those procedures are exactly the ones that are missing, (and by coincidence those procedures with 13L/31R are the same that would also be there for 02/20).
In the MSFS stock files you don’t have those entries, but in the Navigraph Data you have runway transitions for Runway 13L/31R in the Departures:
I assume that might be the real problem. Though still basically an Asobo problem as they are missing the runway…

G:\MSFS\Microsoft Flight Simulator\Community\navigraph-navdata\scenery\fs-base-ng\scenery\0101\NAX15150.bgl
	Airport: TT:AIRPORTLR.KHIO.name
		Ident: KHIO (C1 39 5B 02) @ 237DC
		Name: TT:AIRPORTLR.KHIO.name (54 54 3A 41 49 52 50 4F 52 54 4C 52 2E 4B 48 49 4F 2E 6E 61 6D 65) @ 237FE
		Magvar: 344.0 (00 00 AC 43) @ 237D8
		Departure: BERNI3
			Primary Designation: BERNI3 (42 45 52 4E 49 33 00 00) @ 24810
			Runway Transition: 13R
				Number: 13 (0D) @ 2481F
				Designator: R [2] (02) @ 24820
			Runway Transition: 31L
				Number: 31 (1F) @ 248E7
				Designator: L [1] (01) @ 248E8
		Departure: CANBY2
			Primary Designation: CANBY2 (43 41 4E 42 59 32 00 00) @ 24C10
			Runway Transition: 02
				Number: 02 [2] (02) @ 24C1F
				Designator:  [0] (00) @ 24C20
			Runway Transition: 13L
				Number: 13 (0D) @ 24CE7
				Designator: L [1] (01) @ 24CE8
			Runway Transition: 13R
				Number: 13 (0D) @ 24DAF
				Designator: R [2] (02) @ 24DB0
			Runway Transition: 20
				Number: 20 (14) @ 24E77
				Designator:  [0] (00) @ 24E78
			Runway Transition: 31L
				Number: 31 (1F) @ 24F3F
				Designator: L [1] (01) @ 24F40
			Runway Transition: 31R
				Number: 31 (1F) @ 25007
				Designator: R [2] (02) @ 25008
		Departure: CHISM4
			Primary Designation: CHISM4 (43 48 49 53 4D 34 00 00) @ 250D4
			Runway Transition: 13R
				Number: 13 (0D) @ 250E3
				Designator: R [2] (02) @ 250E4
			Runway Transition: 31L
				Number: 31 (1F) @ 251AB
				Designator: L [1] (01) @ 251AC
		Departure: FARM7
			Primary Designation: FARM7 (46 41 52 4D 37 00 00 00) @ 25620
			Runway Transition: 02
				Number: 02 [2] (02) @ 2562F
				Designator:  [0] (00) @ 25630
			Runway Transition: 13L
				Number: 13 (0D) @ 256F7
				Designator: L [1] (01) @ 256F8
			Runway Transition: 13R
				Number: 13 (0D) @ 257BF
				Designator: R [2] (02) @ 257C0
			Runway Transition: 20
				Number: 20 (14) @ 25887
				Designator:  [0] (00) @ 25888
			Runway Transition: 31L
				Number: 31 (1F) @ 2594F
				Designator: L [1] (01) @ 25950
			Runway Transition: 31R
				Number: 31 (1F) @ 25A17
				Designator: R [2] (02) @ 25A18
		Departure: SCAPO7
			Primary Designation: SCAPO7 (53 43 41 50 4F 37 00 00) @ 25AE4
			Runway Transition: 02
				Number: 02 [2] (02) @ 25AF3
				Designator:  [0] (00) @ 25AF4
			Runway Transition: 13L
				Number: 13 (0D) @ 25BBB
				Designator: L [1] (01) @ 25BBC
			Runway Transition: 13R
				Number: 13 (0D) @ 25C83
				Designator: R [2] (02) @ 25C84
			Runway Transition: 20
				Number: 20 (14) @ 25D4B
				Designator:  [0] (00) @ 25D4C
			Runway Transition: 31L
				Number: 31 (1F) @ 25E13
				Designator: L [1] (01) @ 25E14
			Runway Transition: 31R
				Number: 31 (1F) @ 25E9F
				Designator: R [2] (02) @ 25EA0

Hi Jan,
of course, this is also an issue but than the last patch had changed the logic because till now, when a runway was missing all procedures were disabled and not only the procedures of the missing runway.

Also, I assume that ASOBO had again make some internal changes, which I can’t verify at the moment. The reason for this assumption are the current reports of missing procedures (ie. ZBAA, ESMS, …) which are all included in 2014 but will not be shown. And those two examples have all runways.

I have spend now several hours again and its extremely frustrating for me too, to search what happenend after every update/patch. The communication from ASOBO is extremley unprofesional, beside the SDK documentation.

It looks really we can’t leave the beta status, because we must wait till the MSFS is out of beta also.

… and yes, it’s a public critism on ASOBO/MS. The efforts are too high at the moment to go ahead with our updates. Possible we stop this beta program till the sim is stable enough and the documentation is ready.

Cheers
Richard

Hi Jan,
hi Florian,
after an intensive analyzes in the last couple of days are the reason for the missing procedure indeed exactly what you Jan wrote. The runway 13L/31R is missing and FARM7 and SCAPO7 are assigned to this runways. As @JKTech wrote, we have this procedures included in our files but the sim can´t assign it due the missing runways. Sorry Florian, please open a ticket at ASOBO, that the guys there add the missing runway - after that you can expect the procedures normally.

Thanks Jan for your hint/help …
Cheers,
Richard

Hi Jan and Hi everybody helse here :wink:

sorry for my late reply to your messages and thanks a lot for all your work in investigating this issue.
I will check, how I can open a ticket at ASOBO to have a look at this.
And I understand all your frustration. I hope, you will continue on your efforts to get this running, but I understand, that Asobo has to fix MSFS2020 first…
Regards,
Florian

Either wait for Asobo or until someone makes a fixed freeware, that would fix it too.
To proof this I made an addon based on the stock KHIO where I just added in the missing runway at the published position, and the Procedures appeared:


You can try it yourself if you like, here’s the addon to unzip into the Community folder (I’m no designer, so there are no aligned taxipaths to the new runway, just what was there before in the stock plus the added runway with lighting and markings):
khio-portland-hillsboro.zip (77.5 KB)

What is important is that in the Content.xml you move the addon between the stock data and the Navigraph data. When the addon is after the Navigraph data the Procedures won’t show up!
KHIO-order

Hi,

when i uninstall the Navigraph data, then the missing SIDs appear in MSFS2020. How does it manage to display it with the original Nav-data provided by Microsoft? If the reason for the problems would be missing runways, then I would expect the sids also to be missing with original-data?

@NAVData Whats the best way to open a support ticket with Asobo? Via their forum under flightsimulator.com ?

Again thanks a lot for your work!

Regards,
Florian

Regards,
Florian

@florianzahn
That’s because the default navdata does not have the transitions for the missing runway in the departures.
The data contains each departure only once and the departure contains all transitions for every runway that is available for this departure. The Navigraph data also includes the transitions for the runways missing from the game for those departures, that’s why they are not loaded by the game.

Have you tried the add-on KHIO with the instructions from my last post?

Jan

1 Like

This topic was automatically closed 5 days after the last reply. New replies are no longer allowed.