MMAA glideslope not aligned

Navigation Data ILS
21

Would it be possibe for you to create and editor for the Localizer / Glideslope values so that users can correct them? (coordinates, elevations, course, magvar etc.)

Jeppesen would of course be allowed to recalculate the localizer coordinates on their own. If you would use the state source coordinates in a Level D simulator they would be also off. That is the reason why data providers are allowed to recalculate them since the authorities sometimes do not put much effort into the proper values. So it is a neverending story and going via the authorites is leading to nowhere in certain countries.

The only solution to this for our Flight Sim environment is having an option where either the user or Navigraph is able to correct the Localizer and Glideslope parameters. In case of non-offset localizers they could be automatically aligned to the RWY centerline. A similar thing could be done with GP elevations and distance to threshold to avoid too high or too low GPs.

Regards Jan-Paul

22

Jan-Paul, in the current revision 2 we have re-calculate the loc antenna and as you see on the screenshot before, it’s absolute aligned now with the center line, using the stock scenery.

The question here is, why it’s correct with the stock scenery, but not with the 3rd party scenery? I’m not a scenery designer and I haven’t enough knowledge with this. I can only confirm, that the loc antenna is now corrected with revision 2 and all upcoming cycles.

Cheers
Richard

23

Hi Richard,

my comment was meant as a global one. Due to the fact that state Localizer coordinates are not precise enough for our purpose or published with low resolution there will be always offsets to the MSFS centerline or add on scneries in certain cases.

In order to be independet from state source datas for Localier and GP datas, there should be and editor built by Navigraph where users could correct any sort of misalignement.

Maybe that editor could be connected to a shared database where users could contribute to fix the errors. (Default or Add On Sceneries).
Microsoft has a similar Idea for the Airport itself (World Hub)

Now we just need something similar for the Navaids.

Following values need to be available in the editor:

Localizer:
Identifier, Name, Frequency, Course, Magvar, Range, Width, Coordinates, Elevation

Glideslope: Angle, Range, Coordinates, Elevation
DME: Range, Coordinates, Elevation

One could also do that with ADE for MSFS or the own MSFS editor but for the purpose of Localizer, Glideslope, DME corrections they are not very user friendly and still stick to the idea that navaids and airport scenery are connected to each other and in the same project file That is not the case anymore with MSFS since navaids are now stored in separate BGLs outside of the airport scenery.

In case of the default airports there could also be some automation applied by Navigraph that you always recalculate the Localizer coordinates onto the extended MSFS RWY centerline for non-offset Localizers. In the beginning MS did that already before they discovered that it actually doesn`t work if there is an offset localizer :wink:

Regarding 3rd party scenery: If the scenery designer did not place it exactly where the default scenery was or an old FSX, P3D scenery is used as base, it is very easy to introduce an offset. Also, if the default scenery is not placed where it should be there could be offsets as well. Satelite Images depending on source also could introduce offsets depeing on the date of the picture. (Look at Google Earth where you can see them moving when changing the timeline)

Regards Jan-Paul

24

Hello!

This week was very busy and did not have time to test it until today.

I already tested it and yes, the touchdown is at the center of the runway, but the approach alignment is still to the left of the runway, this happened to me when I was fine-tuning the localizer heading. And as I see on littenavmap when I place navigraph folders in community, it tells me that your localizer has a 5.8 East deviation in rwy28 and 5.1 East on rwy 10, that could be the issue of the alignment. (as the 5 East from “288.1034147” that I set on my scenery is fully aligned in approach and touchdown).

As I wrote before, my scenery was placed just above the satellite image which is why I was getting a 0.2 degree deviation of the runway, and now that the heading is corrected (288.1034147) the approach lights are a little bit offset from the ground image. I think this might be because of the way the image was obtained, it has some tilt, even the buildings I made, I had to make them a little bit bigger than normal to fill all the gaps the tilt made.

But well I just wanted to let you know that your configuration for MMAA was wrong, I did correct it for my scenery and is working completely fine, the issue is with users that have a navigraph subscription, they will be not aligned properly on the localizer pad, only at touchdown.

Cheers!
César Soto.

25

When you use the stock scenery, it’s also correct aligned. And sorry, I guess I have done all, what I can do. I have shown you that the AIP is wrong and we have offered a solution which is working as I also have shown you.

Navigraph subscriber can also use the stock scenery, which are working perfect with our data.

Cheers
Richard

26

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