Issues to select transition on some airports (ex EGLC,LFLL and many others)

[EighteenOSix]

Hello,

it is not possible to me to select any transition approach on some airport, quite weird as i flight really often those one… i tried EGLC, LFLL and some others. it is possible to select it, but once selected it show a direct to IAF on the map and it’s not transcript to the flight plan/Map.

Flight plan exemple :

LFPN to EGLC with STAR SOVAT1C and ILS 09 with ODLIG transition

LFPN to LFLL with STAR LESPI9N and ILS35R with TALAR Transisiton

On both exemple i can select the trasnition but it show direct to IAF without the transition on the flight plan / Map

On some other destination it works fine like LFKJ or LFKB for exemple.

[NAVData]

Hi,
Without at least knowing which sim and which aircraft/addon you are using, I can give you a more or less general answer.

I have looked into our source and our charts, and the transitions are included.

So my assumption is either an aircraft/adon issue/limitation, or you don’t select these initial approaches, or you don’t select them correctly.

Please provide the sim and the aircraft/addon you are using so we can give you a clearer answer.

Cheers
Richard

[EighteenOSix]

I mean on the application or the web application of navigraph chart…each time there’s a transition rnav approach it’s not working anymore…it is not transcript on the map…the map show the final approach only without any transition.

Have a look at LFLL or LFPN or any other final rnav transition approach anyway the rwy

Here’sb EGLC, and it seams it the same each time that we have a rnav route transition approach to the IAF from the STAR

[NAVData]

EGLC has no ODLIG approach transition for 09, only for 27. I have also compared it with UK NATS, no ODLIG transition for 09 either.

Please provide your real-world information on this missing approach transition, so we can report it to Jeppesen.

Thank you
Richard

[EighteenOSix]

Please have a look on the screen i have provided, you see there’s a transition LAV1G. before we can get the trasniton rnav route, it’s not available anymore (no chart) and then no transcription on the map !

it is available in the TDS750nxi database as you can see below

Unfortunately not anymore transcripted on the navigraph application nor the web

It’s globally the same for many airports like LFLL for exemple, where there’s a transition approach and this transition is now on the STAR section and not anymore on the approach section of the selectable chart…then this is not transcripted on the map when we try to select it… that’s a big problem because we can only have a route

[NAVData]

Ah, I understand now. Because you are talking about ODLIG for 09, I was confused.

The problem here is technical. This transition is designed as a STAR, and you can’t combine two STARs.

That’s exactly why FMCs use the VIAs for this, but it is not implemented in the charts app at the moment (possible in the future).

As an immediate workaround, I would add LAV1G as a STAR and manually insert the SOV1A waypoints.

Depending on the aircraft/addon, you can use the VIAs.

Cheers
Richard

[EighteenOSix]

sorry it has always been possible, i am using the app since years…the problem come from the fact that is now available as a star and not a final transition approach.. that’s a problem

[Rodeo314]

As far as I can tell, LAV1G is coded as an approach transition/via, e.g. here in the X-Plane 12 database:

APPCH:010,A,I27,LAV1G,GODLU,EG,E,A,E   , ,   ,IF, , , , , ,      ,    ,    ,    ,    , ,FL100,     ,     ,-,210,    ,   , , , , , ,0,D,S;
APPCH:020,A,I27,LAV1G,ELMIV,EG,E,A,E   , ,   ,TF, , , , , ,      ,    ,    ,    ,    , ,     ,     ,     , ,   ,    ,   , , , , , ,0,D,S;
APPCH:030,A,I27,LAV1G,LCE11,EG,E,A,E   , ,   ,TF, , , , , ,      ,    ,    ,    ,    , ,     ,     ,     , ,   ,    ,   , , , , , ,0,D,S;
APPCH:040,A,I27,LAV1G,LCE12,EG,E,A,E   , ,   ,TF, , , , , ,      ,    ,    ,    ,    , ,     ,     ,     , ,   ,    ,   , , , , , ,0,D,S;
APPCH:050,A,I27,LAV1G,LCE13,EG,E,A,E   , ,   ,TF, , , , , ,      ,    ,    ,    ,    , ,FL100,     ,     , ,   ,    ,   , , , , , ,0,D,S;
APPCH:060,A,I27,LAV1G,RAVSA,EG,E,A,E   ,L,   ,TF, , , , , ,      ,    ,    ,    ,    , ,06000,     ,     , ,   ,    ,   , , , , , ,0,D,S;
APPCH:070,A,I27,LAV1G,GAPGI,EG,E,A,E   , ,   ,TF, , , , , ,      ,    ,    ,    ,    , ,06000,     ,     , ,   ,    ,   , , , , , ,0,D,S;
APPCH:080,A,I27,LAV1G,ATPEV,EG,E,A,E  H, ,   ,TF, , , , , ,      ,    ,    ,    ,    , ,     ,     ,     , ,   ,    ,   , , , , , ,0,D,S;
APPCH:090,A,I27,LAV1G,LCE07,EG,E,A,E   , ,   ,TF, , , , , ,      ,    ,    ,    ,    , ,04000,     ,     , ,   ,    ,   , , , , , ,0,D,S;
APPCH:100,A,I27,LAV1G,TOPDU,EG,P,C,E   , ,   ,TF, , , , , ,      ,    ,    ,    ,    , ,     ,     ,     ,-,210,    ,   , , , , , ,0,D,S;
APPCH:110,A,I27,LAV1G,LAVNO,EG,P,C,EE B, ,   ,CF, ,ILSR,EG,P,I,      ,0919,0069,2730,0042, ,03000,     ,     ,-,185,    ,   , , , , , ,0,D,S;

The issue appears to be a possible/probably bug in the Charts application: when you select the approach with the LAV1G transition, the “Final” transition is selected and depicted instead:

Highlighted in green, where I am clicking.

Highlighted in red, the incorrect/unexpected end result.

Regards,

Tim

Edit: also, when I unload the flight right after selecting I27 with LAV1G:

So the app is somehow aware that LAV1G has been selected, but this is not reflected in the flight itself.

From within the flight, the route edit field shows:

[NAVData]

Tim,
PLEASE STOP comparing specific add-ons. We are talking here from the charts.

Not all such postings are helpful and produce more confusion.

Thank you
Richard

[Rodeo314]

Just tested LSZH:

LSGG/04 SOSA1N SOSAL N871 BERSU BERS2G LSZH/GIPOL.I14

works

LSGG/04 SOSA1N SOSAL N871 BERSU BERS2G LSZH/GIP14.I14

does not.

It appears Charts no longer properly handles cases where the transition identifier/name does not match the transition’s starting waypoint’s identifier/name. I seem to recall a similar bug some years ago, which had been fixed in the meantime.

Regards,

Tim

[Rodeo314]

@NAVData

PLEASE STOP comparing specific add-ons. We are talking here from the charts.

Yes, and LAV1G is listed as an approach transition in Charts too, as in the screenshots above, as well as the amended one below:

So again, the approach transition/via exists and is selectable, but the selection does not “stick”.

Regards,

Tim

Edit: the issue appears similar to this old one:

Impossible to plan EHAM ARTIP 5B transition

Hi, I can confirm this issue with the approach transitions at EHAM. It seems to be a wider issue with such transitions that are named different from their initial fix, which is fairly uncommon. We are investigating but due to holidays it might take a while for this to be resolved. Regards, Stephen

It may of course be that the underlying cause is completely different, but just in case, it might be worth looking into what was done to fix the old issue to see if it possibly also applies here.

[afransson]

Hello!

We recently updated some logic to the route validation. It seems like you have spotted a small bug that removes the transition point incorrectly. We’ll take a look into this.

Best regards,
Albin

[EighteenOSix]

Thank a lot, the issue appears on many other airports (ex in france LFLL or LFMN). For info the bug has appears recently, i am flying mostly daily and it was working well few days ago

[afransson]

Hi again,

This should be fixed now, so you shouldn’t see the transition point issue going into the weekend. Please let us know if it pops up again.

Have a great weekend,
Albin

[EighteenOSix]

It works, super thanks !

[Rodeo314]

Working on my end too.

Cheers,

Tim